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Aline
Member
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 08:11
I misssed the forum about Nivad. I strongly support his rating system, even if it is too severe, IMO. And I appreciate his comments, on my picture as on the others.
Sergio / 3.1416, I agree the rates between people of the same "club" are not fair, but your system is the same. Except you downrate strongly instead of uprate, without any comments. What's the worst ? so in my opinion it is better to say nothing in this conditions.
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joris
Moderator
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 10:22 - Edited by: joris
Thank you all for your suggestions, the problem pointed out by Geoff is also on our minds.
Whatever the solution will be there are a few things you should bear in mind when thinking of new ways to rate, organize or select pictures.
1. Only solutions in which the community (and not the tiny staff of Woophy) makes the selections between interesting and uninteresting pictures are feasible.
2. Many of our current members were mediocre photographers when the joined Woophy and have grown since.
3. Only if people select their own pictures more conscious a limitation might work. It is also possible that the limitation does not influence the average quality of the uploaded pictures but merely the quantity of pictures uploaded. So in theory we might get stuck with less pictures which are equally mediocre.
In fact we are more thinking along the lines of Ortho.
In a newer version of Woophy there should be more possibilities to stumble upon the hidden gems. Some ideas we have to reach this are.
1. Increase the quality of the search engine in such a way that quality floats to the surface much faster. (the reason that it is currently not possible to search for the best pictures is a technical one)
2. Make more cross references between interesting pictures and collections.
3. Reintroduce some interesting lists and charts (but trying to avoid the problems we had earlier with these charts)
4. Organize again monthly competitions (but bear in mind our really tiny staff)
5. Create more possibilities for the individual members to present their pictures, like the travel blog.
In the meantime here some tips to find quality
1. Go to the a page of a member you like and check out his or her favorite photographers and photos, do the same with the members and photos you find doing this.
2. Browse your own favorite members, you can see when they last upload a picture
3. Browse the map and don’t forget to zoom.
4. Browse all the editorial stuff, like the travel blog, the news, the forum, the previous members of the month.
5. Rate, and don’t worry about it
6. Check out the new members on the member page, browse them back in time
Thanks again for all you remarks
Joris
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Aline
Member
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 10:46
@ Joris
I totally agree with your remark 2 : "Many of our current members were mediocre photographers when the joined Woophy and have grown since"
We have to remember that.
Nice suggestions you give.
If I can add one, I noticed the number of "favorites" points is often more significant than the rates. I know a site where it is a factor of search.
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joris
Moderator
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 11:00
deleted a private discussion between two members from this topic
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3.1416
Member
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 11:11 - Edited by: 3.1416
The worst??? I think is give advices of what it is possible to speak or not in this forum.
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M. Knegt
Member
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 11:20
If I can add one, I noticed the number of "favorites" points is often more significant than the rates. I know a site where it is a factor of search.
I think this is a realy good idea, there can be done more with the fact that one photographer is more selected as a favorite. Same thing for pictures itself.
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Ormond
Member
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# Posted: 13 Aug 08 19:59 - Edited by: Ormond
We need to experience cold wet days to fully appreciate warm sunny days!
If we did not know what rubbish looked like would we recognise treasure.
I know Geoffrey you are correct in what you say and I admire you for saying it.
But on a positive note I ask do all the bad photos have the positive effect of making the good photos look even better? Just a thought 
Regards to all
Alan
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Jan Durbin
Member
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# Posted: 14 Aug 08 16:16
Hello! & I agree with Jono. Unless it's hate mail, I would like critique & improvement suggestions, which I have recieved from some of the more experianced, though most will not. I just uploaded a Lot from my vacation in hopes to not only share an experiance but to be open to suggestions.
I have stated this befor without as much detail, so, here is my solution... Woophy has a great set of rules that could be expanded apon, such as, after a Pic. has gone 30-60 days without comment or rating, it be deleated. By Member or Woophy. However, I do not think it would be fair to stifle uploads to a minimum as there is a computer out there that takes all immages from every web sight (even Woophy) to create a Living Earth, from day to day.
It would be a shame to loose some of them for the sake of someones idea of Professional. I am a serious Ammature trying to learn & live to the Best of my ability & if this is now a sight for Just The Best, it should be closed to us or go ahead & charge a fee & see how many members you can loose. Any pompus ....... can give an opinion, how do we know you (the .... ) is really a pro or just paid his dues to have that power. I would leave. I am also To Old.
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Billy Burrows
Member
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# Posted: 15 Aug 08 00:39
It’s probably ( certainly, say my family ! ) my age making me grumpy, but at present I am really struggling to maintain my interest in Woophy.
Geoff
On the day that I have finally signed up to Woophy, I find that you are losing interest. Surely not!
My short time exploring the site confirms your recommendation to join Woophy, based upon the (worldwide) spirit of the site, which is very refreshing. However, your suggestion regarding limiting uploads, and the reasons behind this, is very valid.
Regards
Billy
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catkiller
Member
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# Posted: 15 Aug 08 02:57
Note taken! Yes Grandad!  You are right!!!!
So ...I just deleted over 300 of my photos, some, were not very appreciated by the GREAT members of Woophy,
some.... I used to love them but after learning a bit on this site..... Not so much! (ok.. I admit it, they were crap!)
And some... they are probably crap but... they are my crap!! so they are staying!
Maybe we all could sometimes get rid of the NOT SO GOOD ones and
maybe... that will make us think about not even posting mediocre ones in the future.
we could posibly reduce the flood of mediocrity to a trickle!
we are all responsible for posting crap! Even the GREAT members of woophy. T-shirt or not!
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Jono
Member
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# Posted: 15 Aug 08 12:25
I just wanted to add something to my last post. It is absolutely critical that we get good constructive critisim on our photos so we can learn and grow.
But I did want to add my thanks for all the positive comments I have received (For the most part hopefully where deserved), that have encouraged me to keep taking photos and enjoying being an active member of Woophy.
Surely the first thing we should be achieving by both taking photos the we love, and sharing through Woophy is having fun. Lets not forget that either. (Thats something I learnt from some-one young... see the photo below).
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ortho158
Member
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# Posted: 15 Aug 08 13:57
Very appropriate pic, Jono!
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Ruud~
Member
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# Posted: 16 Aug 08 21:57
Hi Geoff,
You're not getting too old! That's only a feeling, I'm sure. I hope it will pass soon. Thanks for posting the topic because I too suffer from Woophy fatigue occasionally. It happens to almost all of us from time to time. Young and old! I'm just sorry that it makes some people disappear from the site.
Anyway., I'm puzzled about one aspect in this discussion: Who are "the club"?
Is there just one "club", or are there more than one? I've seen The Club mentioned before. It's very mysterious!
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Paulo Calafate
Member
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# Posted: 17 Aug 08 01:54
Maybe the Cotton Club 
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fotogravenswaay
Member
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# Posted: 17 Aug 08 10:52
or the The Breakfast Club???......
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ortho158
Member
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# Posted: 17 Aug 08 11:24
No, no, no: it's the Mickey Mouse Club. 
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Jan Hemels
Member
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# Posted: 17 Aug 08 11:34
Membership is free, you only have to comment actively on pics, those who don't call this a closed club, but they can go for membership this very minute, so what is closed?
Maybe there are more clubs indeed in this definition like a forum club, I sometimes felt it was very close(d), it does not refrain me from writing this.
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Nonkel Duvel
Member
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# Posted: 17 Aug 08 12:40
What do you think about The Buena Vista Social Club... ? 
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Geoffrey McElwaine
Member
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# Posted: 17 Aug 08 13:02
Ive. The Buena Vista Social Club are fabulous although, sadly, some of the members have now died.
To return, finally, to the main point as issue. Thank you for all comments. It really does seem, to me, that Woophy is in danger of becoming like a river choked by weeds. Of course, I use " My favourites " to check on what they are uploading, but am worried that, by doing this, I am missing new Woophy members producing good quality pictures.
As you will also know, from my other Forum comments, I am uneasy about the number of members - and it seems to be increasing all the time - who feel that personal insult, etc. is appropriate during Forum discussion. There was even a brief appearance in this topic. Frankly, I don't need this !
It seems, to me, that Woophy has lost its way - possibly [ and this is no reflection on Joris and his team, who have worked wonders bringing it to the stage it has achieved. ] because it has grown too big to be administered on an amateur basis. In far too many pictures being uploaded, the site's initial overall aim, to show every part of the world, principally through amateur photographs, has vanished : does anyone really believe that pictures of pet cats and dogs contribute to this ?
In addition to a re-assessment of whether its key aim is still relevant, and - if so - how Woophy can continue to meet it, I suggest that more practical decisions are urgently needed on such matters as -
a. Guidance on numbers / quality of uploaded pictures ;
b. Conduct of Forum discussions ;
c. Nomination of T-shirt winner ( I ' won ' mine because of three votes. Not very representative of the views of approximately 27,000 members ! ) ;
d. Competitions.
e. Comments / Rating system.
Despite my frustration, I intend to keep my Woophy Account open.
I also feel that the discussion points I've raised should be discussed in a Forum topic dedicated to them. For this reason I am now closing this topic.
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